RT 80 School Bus Accident 5/17
Greg That explains the large number of ambulances that were on 80. Came from Morristown a few minutes ago and all sorts of emergency vehicles on the road with lights and sirens.
GC 
Calico696 
auntiel 
WashingtonTswp
maja2 Westbound, but both directions are closed. I saw a comment about 4 dead on social media. I hope it's not true.
Michele DeFazio 
smilingbecs 
School bus and dump truck collision. Bus rolled over, multiple serious injuries and ejections. NJSP confirms 1 DOA adult. Helicopters grounded due to weather. Bus from Paramus Middle School on way to Waterloo Village.
@WCAlerts Twitter
Sunshine 
Hackmom 
Reggie Voter Pray for what? There's that loving Jesus for you. Let's kill or seriously injure a bunch of school kids today. Oh, I know, it's God's plan.....
Sorry, probably should have put this in the religion thread. But the thought of these poor kids badly injured and dying because of this crash really makes me ill.
Calico696 people who say stuff like this is God's plan are delusional. A loving God wouldn't want this. We just live in an imperfect world and unfortunately this stuff happens. Hopefully the injured will pull through.
Metsman Another incident involving a dump truck. Man those guys all hopped up on speed trying to make their Tilcon runs. You know the more you make the more you make. Friggin police officers let those guys run amok on the roads. They caused another fatality in the same area not that long ago with a husband and wife. So glad officers are making soft pot busts in this state.
Don Those dump trucks are ALWAYS wreaking havock on rt80. Troopers really need to crack down on these a-hole truckers.
LJRubi 
Dodgebaal 
positive Nobody said it was God’s plan. ??
Just wanted to say a prayer for all involved. Pray for all the children and parents to get thru this.
Such an awful accident. Not meaning to take away from the issue at hand, but does anyone know the best way to get on 80 east from Hackettstown now?
Sunshine619 Best thing this thread should be doing is sharing information and keeping our thoughts to all of those affected. I am sure we will find out what actually happened and then we can judge.
Awesome 
gwtwqueenie Justsayin
You can head over schooley's Mountain, go through Chester, stay on Dover Chester Road, then hop onto 10, then on to 80
OR after going through Chester you can bear right and head towards Morristown and pop onto 80 there
Older Mom So sad and frightening. These trucks are a menace and Rt. 80 is like Thunderdome . I am so sorry for the families involved in this.
Suze +1 Metsman on God.
Take Route 46 to River Road, backroads thru Roxbury to Route 10 I think would be the best bet.
Shirley State Troops shutting things down: http://abc7ny.com/life-threatening-injuries-in-nj-school-bus-crash/3486757/
Lenny Rock So sad.
They are walking around with dogs which may indicate that they haven't accounted for everyone yet.
Did anyone else notice that the dump truck in the live feed (not sure if it is the accident vehicle but it is stopped at the scene) says "In God We Trust" across its tailgate?
I guess that explains their lack of faith in proper vehicle maintenance... God will stop the truck; who needs to check the brakes?
ianimal It is very sad, and a reminder that our roads are dangerous; much more so than schools.
iJay 
Hard to make out the name of the company on the truck involved but it appears to say "Mendez"... which has a business address in Belleville.
Just lovely to the folks who choose tragedy threads like this to knock on people who believe in god. Never let a good opportunity go to waste, I guess.
Rich Mendez Trucking is a common hauler from the Tilcon facility in Wharton/Rockaway. See their trucks all the time.
Joe Friday If going to Waterloo, would you not have taken Exit 25? Next exit is 19. I really hope the driver was not trying to make a U Turn.
JeffersonRepup I will post my thoughts in the religion thread then, since you are all bent out of shape about it.
I sincerely hope then deaths and injuries are minimal.
scottso Dodgebaal I was wondering that as well. The bus is right past the emergency vehicle highway crossover and the dump truck is further down the road. Both vehicles also have severe front end damage which doesn't seem possible if they were both travelling in the same direction.
This is just my speculation and it's tragic no matter how it happened.
Something odd about this bus accident, most of the damage appears on the front end of both vehicles, but both are in the west bound lane. From the story, they were going to Waterloo Village, but the picture look west of the exit for that (unless I'm mistaken). I'm wondering if the bus was turning around or pulling back onto the highway after missing the exit.
Edit: Just read Dodge and Alan posts...
Coach The bus appears to have rear-end damage as well, although it's hard to tell. Perhaps the bus got rear-ended, lost control and hit a stationary object such as the guard rail with the front end.
Dodgebaal- there is another exit after the Budd Lake/Hackettstown one before Exit 19.
Praying for all!
Botheredbyuu2 yes Dodgebaal 25 to Waterloo, you could get off the exit before and then go into the Trade Zone, comes out to the same intersection eventually to get to Waterloo Road.
ianimal, I was thinking that as well. I wouldn't want to think that a school bus driver would take a chance like that...
They said there were a total of 3 buses going to Waterloo village from the school, hard to believe one tried to turn around.
trick I was thinking the same thing, that maybe the bus driver tried to turn around. Maybe that was the first bus and when it realized everyone else got off, they tried to turn around.
KSmith scottso,
I thought the accident was after 25, and I did not know there were any other exits between 19 and 25, I could be mistaken as others have posted.
Denis Budd Lake/Hackettstown is Exit 26; Exit 25 is US 206N (Stanhope/Newton). There aren't any exits between 25 and 19.
Was in the accident mess heading eastbound from Allamuchy to Trade Zone! One lane on the eastbound side is open, all closed westbound. All traffic exiting at the trade zone. 46 is a mess any way you go. I am sure it will float south to 78. The accident scene is awful. The window of the truck poped out appears to sit on the engine. The one bus is on its side near the center divider, as if turned and slid. There was a second Paramus bus that was over by the side of the road. Whatever you believe, this is a tragedy.
acl76 The photo of the bus shows it just west beyond exit 25. The overpass is International drive. It appears the bus missed the exit for Waterloo and perhaps attempted to slow and use the turn around in the median right there. Pure conjecture of course but plausible.
This is an aerial view of the location.
https://www.google.com/maps/search/exit+25+rt+80/@40.9060787,-74.7251454,583m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en
You know it must be bad, when something in Mt. Olive makes the top of the CNN home page--AND it's considered bigger news than a Hawai'ian volcano erupting and sending an ash cloud 30,000 feet into the air.
JerseyWolf yep agree about the dump trucks. deal with them, and even semis daily on that same stretch. dump trucks seem to think since they're a bigger vehicle, they get run of the road. almost had the front of my car taken off by one a few times, they don't look or if they do, they assume you're just going to let them in and if not, oh well they're coming over. even if you're not being a dick and purposely blocking them. couple this with people who just HAVE to weave in and out of traffic and switch lanes thinking they're going to get through slow traffic faster and 80 can easily be a fight to stay alive and in one piece especially during rush hour. can't wait til i don't have to deal with that area anymore during commute time
Richard Zainab Qureshi, 11, one of the fifth grade students on the class trip, had been on one of the two buses not involved in the crash. She said those two buses made it to Waterloo Village, but about 30 minutes later, chaperones and teachers told students they were turning around and returning to school because of bad weather.
She said all students boarded the buses and were on the way back to their school when students began to realize the third bus was missing.
https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/morris/2018/05/17/school-bus-accident-route-80-mount-olive-nj-shuts-down-highway/618980002/
The picture they just had on news12 does make it look like it was trying to make the u-turn, was hit from behind and pushed past it. They did not say it but the picture would make sense.
I've missed that exit before and had to backtrack 12 miles, so I know it hurts. If this driver missed the exit, I could see where he/she might have thought about turning back, or even slowing down.
I really hope that is not what happened. That bus should have been in the right lanes for the exit.
this is so sad. everyone is talking about the dump truck but what about bus safety. do the buses have seat belts, air bags etc? maybe we need to
look at bus safety closer to avoid something like this from happening again. being ejected from a bus sounds like seat belts weren’t in use. god bless the families who lost someone today.
The article says that the kids had to undo their seat belts and climb out the roof exits and side windows. So yes, the bus had seat belts. RIF!
I wonder due to the location of the accident and how the bus is spread the way it is in the pictures that the driver tried to actually turned around within the exit and then collided with the dump truck. I thought I read in another news site that they all got to Waterloo and was told after about 30 mins that they have to go back due to bad weather. And perhaps this bus ended up taking the Rt 80 west exit instead of east? it happened around 10:20ish so if they left school at 9am according to school website and made it there before 10am and had to go back timeline seems close enough and location of the accident is pretty much just under the overpass/bridge.
Just a thought.
momOf2 All NJ school buses have seat belts, it's the law. All bus drivers tell the students to buckle up, it's the law. K thru 8 students are always very good wearing their seat belt, it's been ingrained in them since birth. High School also, but when they get to that age they feel they are invincible. Unless there is an aide on the bus whose job is to solely check seat belts there will always be the few not wearing them. Or unbuckle once they know the driver is not watching them because they are watching the road and driving. One child being killed on a bus is one to many, but had the kids not been wearing their seatbelt. You can guess the outcome. This is a tragic accident. All school bus drivers today are sick over it and quite shook up. Myself included.
Momof2- The report was that two of the buses arrived at Waterloo. After 30 mins when the third bus did not arrive is when it was discovered what happened. The two buses then left Waterloo and returned to the school.
I'm thinking they told the children on the 2 buses they were leaving due to bad weather, as not to upset the children by telling them that the 3rd bus was in an accident.
aaeadena aaeadene- I'm sure you are correct about telling the students about the tragedy. Weather was a perfect reason to get them out of there without unnecessary worry.
"I wonder due to the location of the accident and how the bus is spread the way it is in the pictures that the driver tried to actually turned around within the exit and then collided with the dump truck."
...or tried to cut across 80 after realizing they got on 80W instead of 80E while returning from Waterloo Village.
In my diagram green arrows are the path the buses should have taken and red arrows are the path the one bus may have tried to take (perhaps it was the lead bus but the driver saw the other buses turn left after they had already turned right and he/she just lost focus/panicked/tried to cut across the turnaround directly by the end of the on-ramp).
Mark Mc. Positive- An EMS who was at the scene told me. Now I am sure there needs to be an autopsy for confirmation. There were a couple of very brave men on the scene who assisted getting those kids out. I personally Thank God most survived. So many lives have been affected, the families, the school, the town, the bus company, the truck driver, all the students and their families. Tragic.
In regards to my post - that was assuming all 3 buses did in fact leave Waterloo Village.
If that was a cover story and the 3rd bus never made it there to begin with it does look more like the missed exit scenario (similar enough though - perhaps trying to make that U turn).
In either case, based on the origin/destination, that exact location wasn't on the correct route so there's more to it than just a fast dump truck.
I was at the er when this happened. The staff and all involved should be commended. I was very impressed. Prayers to all.
Animal lover Mark, I'm leaning towards your second scenerio. What gets me, is why wasn't the bus in one of the right lanes (assuming the driver knew the exit would be coming up), like Dodgebaal mentioned?
Maybe I shouldn't be speculating so much..it's just, so upsetting.
@ Animal lover. Did they bring all of those children to H Hos. The activity on Willow Grove was, well put it this way I haven't seen that many ambulances since 911. Bravo to our ER. I got thinking, how were the families able to get their children? The highway was closed, traffic backed up. I just can't wrap my head around it. What a nightmare for them. How were those kids transported back to Paramus??
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As a former EMT, and naturally a former innocent child, this sickens me.
Even those that survive are forever changed and scarred.
Not the good type of scarred and changed that makes you a better person.
There is a reason every time we are right behind a bad accident I tell my wife to get back in the car and keep driving. She wants to save the world- the last thing I need her to see is a dead child, a person with an arm ripped off, etc.
There is no excuse, and if there were ANY sort of god this wouldn't ever happen.
I don't care what the published reason will be- there is no reason for this.
Both a bus and a dump truck should be operated in a manner to allow ample space and time around you for the other idiots on the road and time to slow / stop, turn- etc.
Both vehicles are being operated in a diminished capacity due to Newton's law given their mass- but also a MUCH greater responsibility due to the extreme damage they can do- both to other vehicles and occupants.
:(
Josh 
Stymie About 2 hours ago my Facebook page featured a suggested post encouraging affected families to contact Morgan & Morgan P.A. to begin claims for financial compensation.
Disgusting!!!
MikeL I saw that kids were transported to Hackettstown, Morristown and St. Joe's in Patterson
Living life boldly.. There is a group on Hackettstown fb group who want to organize some support for families involved with this horrific accident, but we need to know what Hackettstown Hospital allows, anyone work there or know someone?
Hackettstown wife Hackettstown wife,
The hospital doesn't control anything like that, contact the school in Paramus.
From Facebook:
"State Police Investigate Fatal School Bus Crash
Mount Olive, N.J. –The New Jersey State Police is investigating a crash between a school bus carrying fifth-grade students and a dump truck, which killed two people and seriously injured several others earlier this morning.
Based on the preliminary investigation, at 10:20 a.m., a school bus carrying 38 fifth-grade students and 7 accompanying adults from East Brook Middle School entered westbound Interstate 80 from southbound U.S. Highway 206. In the area of milepost 25.1, the school bus and a Kenworth dump truck collided, which caused the bus to overturn.
As a result of the crash, one adult and one student were killed, and a total of 43 people were injured and transported to area hospitals. Twenty-one victims were transported to Morristown Medical Center, 10 to Hackettstown Hospital, 4 to St. Clare’s Denville, 3 to St. Clare’s Dover, 3 to UMDNJ Newark, and 2 to St. Joseph’s in Paterson. Some patients are in critical condition."
NJSP now investigating whether bus possibly made illegal U-turn.
http://abc7ny.com/child-and-teacher-killed-43-hurt-in-nj-school-bus-crash/3486757/
Lifeistooshort Every article I've read, stated a teacher and a student didn't make it.
There's no mention of the bus driver's condition, or the bus driver having a heart attack or conducting an autopsy on the bus driver who supposedly is still alive? Confused....
Look at the back part of the frame, bent clearly to the right.
May have been sticking out in the lanes during a U turn and the dump truck hit it from the left.
Makes sense, Mark,
That would also pull the frame out from under the bus.
To me it made no sense where the bus was located if going to Waterloo.
The next exit is pretty far at 6 miles away. The incentive to do the U-Turn?
I’m just as confused as you are Positive. I saw the Governor’s press conference this afternoon and I swear he said the bus driver was alive in a hospital. Obviously they didn’t release the drivers condition and maybe things have changed since the Governor spoke to the press but I think there would have been an official press release if anything happened.
Snow Investigators are looking into whether the school bus was trying to make a left turn in the median before the crash, and whether that was when the dump truck and bus collided, a senior law enforcement official told News 4. The official cautioned that the investigation was still early and that no conclusion had been reached.
State police said the truck driver had been interviewed following the wreck. The school bus driver is still being treated for injuries and has not yet been interviewed.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/School-Bus-Accident-New-Jersey-Police-482924481.html
@ Mark Mc. Agreed. From the aerial picture of the frame you can clearly see how the frame is bent in the back on the driver’s side. Additionally there’s a photo on New Jersey.com showing the bus lying on its side. This photo was taken from the other side of the highway (westbound side) In this picture you can see the buckling of the passenger side body right by the wheel well.
TheSoundGuy I am also confused now positive. People on the scene don't know everything. I apologize for the miss information. Lesson learned. I will say I do hope ( not wish) it was illness on the bus drivers part and not the U turn. That would be beyond disturbing. The only thing I do know for a fact is, 40+ 10 yr. olds went through a horrific ordeal today. Something I have never been through nor do I wish on anyone else. I will pray to my God for comfort and healing for all involved.
No need to apologize auntiel, things like that happen.
My main concern right now are the ones in critical condition. I will continue to pray..
Just to recap, you had an EMT friend violate HIPAA, you then posted the info here calling for an autopsy on the driver that wasn't dead, and NOW you admit that you're confused. Just sayin'
Skippy So so sad. Hopefully people can post here with fundraiser info for the victims if one is made. I also wonder if there will be a community vigil for the child and adult killed?
Justin I knew it. The left turn into the median theory is what I thought and posted very early this afternoon. See above with the photos I attached.
I'm sorry I was correct in my thoughts. How tragic that human error caused this.
I believe it is illegal in NJ for the dump truck to even be traveling in the left lane correct?
renew Yes, you are right skippy. I should've included everyone involved in my post, (I've been praying for everyone involved all day), but my initial thought was about the ones that are fighting for their lives. Please no more casualties.....
Sure, but not if they are trying to avoid a bus unexpectedly merging/turning left in front of them.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/School-Bus-Accident-New-Jersey-Police-482924481.html
Multiple sources tell News 4 New York that video from a Department of Transportation camera shows the school bus making a sudden U-turn in a media.
There were three school buses taking students from the same school on the field trip, sources said. Of the three buses, one missed the exit, video shows. When the driver realized this, he apparently saw a designated U-turn area for emergency vehicles ahead -- and cut across lanes of traffic to try to make the U-turn.
A dump truck traveling in the same direction slammed into the bus as it suddenly appeared in front of him, the sources said, citing DOT footage. Investigation is still early, and no conclusion has been reached.
State police said the truck driver had been interviewed following the wreck. The school bus driver is still being treated for injuries and has not yet been interviewed.
This was very said this happened. It affected many people, and towns. It would of been nice to have seen more of a police presence in town today to make sure all the detour traffic went smoothly. Alot of horns going off. Not everyone new what was going on and why all these rigs were coming through town. Luckily no accident.
American born Hackettstown was supposed to have an emergency plan for just such an occurrence, after a similar incident (10?) years ago. There have been several times since when Route 80 was closed and town became clogged. Apparently that plan was never implemented.
This thread is getting ridiculous.
The school bus originated from Paramus and was going to Waterloo village (not in Hackettstown). The accident occurred in Mount Olive (not in Hackettstown).
This hysteria over this accident is only because of the inconvenience due to the traffic issues.
Thoughts and Prayers to all inconvenienced.
First let me say my prayers and thoughts go out to the loved ones who lost their lives in this horrible accident and that all those children recover quickly. I'm a mother to a first grader so it really hits hard to see what happend with that bus... But I am also a wife of a trucker/owner. I'm terrified everyday to get a call or worse see it all over social media that something happend. All these ignorant comments about truck drivers and how quick you all are to put blame on them are just that ignorant. Not all drivers or companies are idiots or crazy or neglectful. Everything from the clothes you wear the car you drive the food you eat the mulch you put in your yard the sand on the baseball field your kids play baseball on to the roads you drive on has all been on a truck at some point so without truckers you would be with out. This was a sad tragic accident that could of been avoided but the bus driver made a huge life changing mistake not the trucker. So people need to stop with the ignorant comments and post blaming truckers instantly. Educate yourself a little.
Sw9B No, it isn't. Hackettstown is supposed to have an emergency plan in place for when an incident occurs on route 80, and traffic is detoured thru our town.
They have failed to implement the promised plan several times.
Somebody needs to be accountable for that.
Of course, it should go without saying, that everyone feels great sorrow for those involved, injured and the families of the deceased and their friends.
If any good comes out of this, it's that maybe other parts of the country will start making seatbelts mandatory on school buses. As it is now, only 6 states have that requirement. I shudder to think what this would have been like if they weren't all wearing their seatbelts.
I agree, Reggie. Even if no such plan exists, it SHOULD exist, and it SHOULD be implemented. This is not the first time a major incident on I-80 (or elsewhere) has cased overwhelming congestion on Rt. 46 (in Hackettstown and elsewhere). And that congestion can lead to other incidents, in addition to costing money and causing major inconvenience.
Even one person (a police officer or appointed civilian) quickly putting up a couple of "I-80 Detour" signs and directing traffic at that awful light at Willow Grove and Mountain Avenue could do a lot to make such a problem safer and more convenient.
It's called over population......
If just one of our roadways gets shut down....it's total chaos....but sure...keep building more homes, town homes, and apartments...just turn a total blind eye.
God forbid something happened to route 80 that had it shut down for a week......
Darrin People guessing about what happened. A lot doesn't make sense about how the accident happened. Lets wait and see what the investigation reveals.
God bless all involved. Praying for all the victims.
The bus made a sudden illegal u turn in the median, that is what caused the crash. Also, stopping suddenly in a large vehicle such as a dump truck, especially if it is carrying a full load, is near impossible. They don’t stop like cars do.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/national-international/New-Jersey-School-Bus-Crash-Class-Field-Trip-I-80-Investigation-483006241.html
Jesse341 @Sw9b the trucking company involved (Mendez) has been involved in 8 crashes in the past two years and had over 200 violations. Yes it seems this was a grave error on the bus drivers fault, however there can be no dispute on the recklessness of many truck drivers and the companies behind them. That's not to say they are not necessary or passenger cars are driven perfectly but clearly there is an issue.
With that said, I wish the best for those involved and and feel deep sorrow for those who lost loved ones.
JYM Hey Jym what about all the safe truck drivers and companies. I’d say they far outweighe the bad ones!! Accidents happenwith all types of vehicles everyday.. Part of the problem with these trucking companies is that it’s a lot of work and very expensive to own and operate.. Everyone is always so quick to blame the truck drivers. People are in such a rush to go nowhere’s these days they cut off trucks right and left. Mabey people should be a little more alert and courteous and some of these issues can be avoided!! At the end of the day this is just a horrific accident no matter who’s at fault!!! Instead of playing the name n blame game think about how we all can be better drivers!!!!I know I am praying for everyone involved and am grateful that a lot of great people (motorist first responders, etc.) were there to help and assist!!!!!
Mr. tone It certainly appears the bus driver was at fault, his action started the incident. He should probably be tried for manslaughter. If the dump truck was in the left lane illegally, he should get cited for the law HE broke, but it appears, from what we know now, this accident was caused by the actions of the bus driver.
3wbdwnj Even the NBC article is SPECULATION. They say "sources" who could just as easily be the rumor mongers here.
This boy who was on the bus says nothing about a U turn: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E4AuUvR4Ik
It may turn out it was, but stop guessing. That's all you're doing, and guessing is the start of rumors who then become "sources".
There is a New Jersey traffic camera right at Exit 25. Years ago when I lived in Pennsylvania I used to check it and call my wife as she was traveling to Mount Olive for work. I used to check that camera to see how far backed up it was because she would exit at the trade zone. It used to be listed on NJ 511 traffic cameras but as of yesterday it was not listed. Be used to be the farthest camera West that you can view on 80.
CJ. I used to look at those often as well, CJ. It is possible once the accident was under investigation, they pulled that camera from the public live feed. I did read several reports that stated a traffic camera showed the bus slowing for the turn. It must have been that one.
The whole event is just a terrible, sad situation for all involved.
When a MAJOR interstate is closed, and the primary secondary state Highway just happens to also be our Main Street you have to deal with it! How do you think residents of Mt Olive and Washington Township felt, they were inconvenienced much worse! People died!
I really don't want to believe that the school bus driver made the decision of attempting an ilegal u-turn with a bus full of kids.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-jersey-school-bus-crash-driver-illegal-u-turn-officials-say/
But I do not believe the version that the bus was coming from the ramp...
BrownEyesGuy School busses are not made for high speeds or high impact crashes (no air bags) so... How about this.... If a class trip is planning on traveling on any major highway at high speeds, they have parents pay for a chartered bus.
Cmc 
Eperot I don't understand, there were 47 people on that bus. Some (thankfully!) only suffered minor injuries. There were adult chaperones on the bus...nobody on the bus can tell the police if the bus was making a u-turn or not, or entering/exiting a ramp or what happened??? This whole incident is heartbreaking and also strange. At that time of the morning there had to be other cars on rt 80 that saw the whole thing unfold and from what i've read the driver of the dump truck was injured, but is recovering - he's not in a coma, can't tell the police if the bus made an illegal u-turn in front of him or not? Very frustrating.
Heidi I agree BEG. If you look at the aerial view, the acceleration lane (ramp) leading onto the interstate west merges very close the u turn in the median. It would be absolutely crazy to attempt that in a sports car let alone a school bus with the most precious cargo. In addition if the bus was going back to the school early, there was no reason to worry about time. Simply take the what 20 minute trip to exit 19 and back to correct a wrong turn.
I stand by my original statement that that bus missed the exit, saw the possible u turn and attempted it with tragic results.
Link to aerial photo.
https://www.google.com/maps/search/exit+25+rt+80/@40.9060787,-74.7251454,583m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en
That school district is going to wish it outsourced it's bus drivers to a third party.
From an NBC report:
"Investigators told NBC 4 that video footage from a Department of Transportation camera shows the bus cutting across lanes of traffic to attempt an illegal through a U-turn area for emergency vehicles. The video reportedly shows the dump truck slamming into the bus as it attempts to get onto I-80 eastbound."
I guess the above mentioned traffic camera is in fact in use.
Heidi, how do you know that several people haven't told the police that very thing but the police aren't releasing any information until their investigation is complete? Why do you assume that just because no one is telling YOU what happened, that no one knows?
I should add I am in no way vilifying the driver. He or she made a very bad decision and will live with it for the rest of their lives. Pure and unrelenting torture on the soul I'm quite sure.
ianamal -- Because the last report said that the cause of the accident was still under investigation. If they already know what happened they would say they would be doing a press conference (or something) to inform the public what happened at a later date (or whatever). Every article available states they don't know yet. Why would they lie and say they "don't know" if they do? That would be even weirder.
They don't have to tell anyone anything until they are ready but to make it sound like it's a mystery is odd. In other accidents (like the one on 80 where that couple were killed a few months back) they knew exactly what happened and said that they would be letting the public know soon. they never once said they were "investigating" or "trying to figure out" what happened.
That's why.
There are several reports out on the national networks stating the bus made the u turn.
Here is one from CBS for example.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-jersey-school-bus-crash-driver-illegal-u-turn-officials-say/
Saying that the "cause of the accident is still under investigation" is not the same as saying "we don't know what happened". This is an accident involving 40 kids. They aren't going to conclude the investigation in 24 hours.
Bug3.... No
And they still have to do other things like tox screens, mechanical testing on brakes and such.
Once you have been deposed you learn there are 5 ways to ask the same question and one answer can mean 5 different things.
If the cause was as it LOOKS and the bus was attempting to make an illegal u-turn, with the dump truck colliding into it from the left lane, both were at fault. Trucks are not to be in the passing lane, nor should the bus driver have been attempting to cross over. It was a tragic accident, but one that would not have happened if both drivers obeyed the laws. Some news broadcasts are saying this WAS the case, while others say it is still being investigated. So I guess we really have to wait for everyone to agree.
"New Jersey
Trucks may not drive in far left-hand lane of roadway with three or more lanes, except for up to one mile before a left-hand turn, to enter or exit roadway, or due to emergency conditions."
This was taken from a New Jersey Traffic Laws site.
Parental Unit I think it is all trucks Calico. I was in a small 18' box truck not long ago and we got pinched for driving in the left lane on 287. I was not the driver.
I thought that I heard that the truck kept moving over to get out of the way of the bus that kept coming over because he was probably trying to avoid impact. So if he was indeed in the left lane, it was through no fault of his.
Walking Girl Obviously we will all need to wait for the final response from the authorities. However, most of you are assuming that the impact occurred in the fast lane. Take a look at the pictures on NJ.com while they are still up. That chassis extends across several lanes. There's streaks of mud and dirt extending westward in what looks like the middle lane. Is it plausible to think the initial impact occurred in the center lane?
I read that the bus driver missed the Waterloo Viillage exit for Rt. 206 and made a U-Turn to get back to the Waterloo exit going Eastbound.
Hackresident Calico, I just copied and pasted from the site I found. It did not specify what type of truck. So I can't give you a definitive answer. But dump trucks can have a lot weight and traveling at a high speed would have great difficulty stopping. Personally I avoid Rt. 80 if it's at all reasonable because of the reckless way all truckdrivers drive. They all tailgate if you are not going fast enough for them. If a car has any kind of breakdown, there would be no way they would be able to avoid driving right over them. I have been tailgated while going 75 MPH. But even that's not fast enough. But I refuse to go any faster than that. I've even had a horn blown at me while going that speed. Police should be handing out more tickets. Maybe then things will change.
JW I agree. People get over it and wait. All the blame and specualtion takes away from the fact that lives were lost and many more will be changed forever.
My child just got off the school bus and told me that the substitute bus driver told the kids to "PUT YOUR SEAT BELTS ON !" You don't want to get into a bus accident do you?" .......... This world we live in.
HappyTeacher Sorry, but using two peoples deaths as a fear factor for 3rd graders on a bus is pretty low.
Philliesman IDK, maybe kids should realize how important it is to wear a seat belt. Sometimes scare tactics work best. Don't some high schools put wrecked cars out front near the end of the school year to demonstrate what can happen if you drink and drive or text while driving?
Nosila Calico I have seen the wrecked car as an awareness tool around prom time too. A scare tactic about the perils of drunk driving. I'm all for it.
I also feel scare tactics are necessary in other areas. For example the Juvenile Awareness Programs (Scared Straight) works as well.
“Sometimes scare tactics work”
Yes, but what’s the real lesson learned in that case?
justintime Any anti-drug program in school should include the Faces of Meth website. "This is your brain on drugs" didn't work, but you bet your ass "this is your FACE on drugs" would...
Believe me when I tell you some get scared and some can careless.
And if you see a student telling a news crew at the end of an every 15 minutes presentation " OMG it was so real i was crying and scared..." stay away from that drama.
https://www.gofundme.com/miranda039s-going-home-service
Here’s a link to support the little girl’s family who lost her life yesterday.
I can't and do not want to imagine it.
There is nothing and I mean nothing worse than losing a child.
Concerning the gofundme, well they have exceeded their goal. Though no amount of money is going to help with the pain...
The beloved wife and teacher:
https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/bergen/paramus/2018/05/18/jennifer-williamson-husband-statement-paramus-school-bus-accident/622723002/
No gofundme, strange..thought that was the norm
A Go fund me type of assistance is set up for friends, relatives, and in particular strangers to be able to give something tangible, in this case money to the family of a victim of a tragic event. It's a way for people to express compassion and offer something to help and perhaps console in anyway they can a fellow human being who has suffered some catastrophic event. Sure is it the same as holding that person close and telling them it will be all right, or even the impossible task of taking back the tragic event, no of course not. It's human nature to want to help another in time of need. In these instances people aren't sure what to do. It is something many people, good people, are compelled to and have the means to do financially. You may not want to contribute and clearly find it unnecessary. However I as well as many do not. So it's best you keep your passive-aggressive dislike for it to yourself. In my opinion of course.
No, in my opinion a gofundme is for people who are completely destitute and need help usually for medical assistance. It should certainly not be used for profit or gain.
I'm sorry Greg, but my passive-aggressive mind is not sitting well with the above gofundme. Out of respect, I will not elaborate my thoughts on here.
So sad. Seems like they were a very nice couple. Heartbreaking.
I personally dislike GoFundMe. I'm not sure why people think that everyone needs money when someone dies. Many people have life insurance and/or money in the bank.
The gofundme for the child I understand. Most of us don’t have life insurance on our kids and I know I do not personally have enough money in my bank account to cover the cost of a funeral if my daughter were to pass away. I would need help but I would go to family first
Njlawyer "Most of us don’t have life insurance on our kids"
That's too bad. My parents did, and if I had kids I would. It's relatively inexpensive.
That’s great Calico. I never had it and I never had it for my kids. Probably should’ve done it but in a million years never thought they would predecease me. I bet a lot of parents might think that way.
@positive - who in your emails privately come off a bit negative, I only posted the GoFundMe link as info as to who the little girl was that so tragically died in that accident. I also am not big on the GoFundMe. I would rather give money directly.
That being said, I believe that you can also comment on the GoFundMe without donating so that is an outlet for folks to express their condolences to this family.
AND even if this acccount reaches 1 million $$, no amount can ever heal this family’s broken heart.
WG - My husband and I both have plenty of life insurance. So if anything happens to either of us, don't send money, send beer!!! ;-)
I think money is more important when adults die. If my husband died, even with insurance, I could not afford to stay in my house.
You are correct HappyTeacher. We planned for retirement and had life insurance also. My husband has been gone for over 15 years and the insurance money is gone and I am now living off our investments which will have to last the rest of my life. I have lived rather frugally, but just basic living expenses are very costly. I don't see how anyone could live on Social Security alone. Fortunately my children are both grown and on their own. So it's just me.
Walking girl, I PMed you because I had questions and concerns. If it came across as negative, I apologize. That was not my intention.The other reason why I PMed you, was to NOT derail this very sensitive thread.
I admit I'm very ignorant and old school concerning gofundme, but most importantly, this tragedy really hit me and had me thinking about my own daughter and how would I cope and what I would do and not do.
Positive is not always positive...just human.
That little baby had a twin sister, ugh, just keeps getting sadder....
You know exactly what you were doing by messaging me and I’m not the only one to receive a message from you on this subject.
You must be the only lawyer in NJ that would not be able to afford the cost of a funeral for a loved one.
We need to start a gofundme for poor lawyers.
Bwwahaaaaaawaaaahaaaaaa
The gofundme for the child I understand. Most of us don’t have life insurance on our kids and I know I do not personally have enough money in my bank account to cover the cost of a funeral if my daughter were to pass away. I would need help but I would go to family first
Njlawyer
I know they are still investigating, but it seems like they have decided it was the vis drivers fault for making an illegal u-turn into traffic.
Anyone know what happens to the bus driver? Any charges yet?
Melissa WG, yes, I emailed 3 people; you, because you posted the link, the 2nd person was in response to their post which was directed towards me and a 3rd person that I knew would understand.
None of my emails were rude.
Don't worry I will never pm you again, that was the first and last.
I checked to see if there were any new developments, I didn't find anything. Does anyone else know of any new developments concerning the investigation?
Jim L I heard that all three of the busses used the illegal u-turn, and two made it through, but the last one didn't.
Is that accurate?
That doesn’t sound right. Only two of the buses made it to their destination.
As for GoFundMe, I don’t think money received for deaths just pays for funerals. Your entire lifestyle changes and while you’re putting your house up for sale or finding roommates that extra money really helps.
Most School buses today have cameras in the bus. If that bus did have a camera and if it made it through the crash, that is a very important piece of evidence. And I for one wouldn't want to be the person to view it.
In P.A., If the field trip is more than 45 mins away a coach bus has to be used. By law.
Why would you want to view the DOT video? Is these cases that seems to be for use by the investigators not the public.
*****updated story from NJ.com**** According to the article, they have had access to the DOT video. The dump truck was in the center lane as I always expect that from the start.
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2018/05/nj_school_bus_accident_weve_seen_the_video_and_bus_drivers_actions_are_inexplicable.html#incart_2box_nj-homepage-featured
So, it *APPEARS* he tried to get from the on ramp all the way over to either the HOV lane or the emergency U-turn. No one in their right mind would try such a thing on Rt80, especially with a vehicle that handles like a pig (school bus), and with CHILDREN onboard...
So maybe there is something to auntiel's rumor above of a heart attack (or something) happening to the driver? Really want to give him the benefit of the doubt of not being that effing stupid and reckless.
He is 77 years old. There is going to be an even stronger argument now for retesting of older people in order to keep their driver's licenses.
77 really? Yeah that's no good. No 77 year old should be driving a bus full of kids for that distance.
I don't think this had anything to do with his age. I think it was a totally inexcusable reckless act on his part, and he should be held accountable. Watching the news tonight they said he had 7 tickets for speeding when he was younger, and had his bus driver license suspended twice ( not for driving infractions ). Having said that though, I do see the logic in having an age limit for school bus drivers.
HOV lane? i thought we sent those stupid things packin' with Christine "the air is safe" Whitman?
Yes, agree with Denis. Age has nothing to do with it, but good judgement does. I'd think better judgement comes with age? Anyway, I'm baffled...why was he coming off 206..when 206 would be on route to Waterloo?
I guess we will have to wait until he is well enough to tell his side of the story.
Pilots have mandatory retirement at 65. These commercial drivers need to retire at 70 to maybe 75. Problem is most don't have the teacher benefits like pension and retiree medical, so they work until they die or almost die. Maybe if we didn't overcompensate educators and have too many Administrators, there would be money to compensate the bus drivers better?
Curiosity is getting the better of me now. Why was the bus already on Route 206 and merging back on to Route 80? He must have been totally lost and trying to get turned around to head north on 206 and somehow ended up on ramp to 80. I'm sure, at that point, he was frustrated, and thought heading across 80 so he could get back on 206 north was a good idea? Can't imagine he was familiar with this area, maybe listening to one of those GPS voices, telling him to do a U-turn?
Lonesome Dove There is no jail time for making an illegal u-turn or even for a dump truck in the left lane..if either driver was under the influence then they will get punished for that ..otherwise it's just a tragic accident
If I were that driver I wouldn't want to recover knowing what happened. That's tough to live with.
Could you imagine the uproar if we made everyone over 60 retake driving test along with medical / vision testing?
The AARP members would be out in force with pitchforks..
"There is no jail time for making an illegal u-turn or even for a dump truck in the left lane..if either driver was under the influence then they will get punished for that ..otherwise it's just a tragic accident"
But there is for manslaughter. If the bus driver was not under the influence and did not have a medical issue, it would be reckless operation resulting in death- manslaughter.
Not that it matters much at 77 years old and already in bad shape from the accident; he probably wouldn't live long enough to see a trial.
https://patch.com/new-jersey/hackettstown/s/gfflj/77-year-old-driver-in-fatal-nj-school-bus-crash-idd?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_term=weather&utm_campaign=alert
a 77-year old bus driver with past suspended licenses and speeding, etc.!!
"How the bus became turned around and headed back southbound down Route 206 and onto Route 80 remains a mystery." (From the above article)
That's what really makes this confusing. If the bus originally exited from 80W onto 206N there's no easy way to turn around and get back on 206S without passing International Drive (which was the desired road) going all the way through Byram and taking side streets (maybe the loop by Acorn Street?) and then passing the ramp for International Drive *again*.
Another possibility... did the bus get off 80W too early, take 46 to International Drive, but miss the left turn onto Continental Drive and then just continue onto 206S?
Missing International/Continental Drive from either direction means the driver also didn't see the large directional signs pointing to Waterloo Village.
Either way, that driver seemed to be completely lost in the area - probably (as I said above) getting a little panicked about being lost, and then just made some very bad decisions.
"past suspended licenses and speeding"
Well, not defending him in this particular accident but those suspensions were for unpaid parking tickets, and 8 speeding violations in a 26 year period with the most recent (per the article) being 17 years ago really isn't the most damning evidence.
Monday morning quarterbacking the driver's actions can continue forever, but it won't bring back the teacher, the student, or heal any of the injured any faster. The video already showed what, and the why is only in the head of the driver. Let that be a matter for the authorities.
Otherwise, all those victims need a lot of time and support. May they find it and heal quickly.
This will all fall on the shoulders of Paramus BOE, the school and the district. This was a Paramus School Bus, not an out side bus company. The BOE and the driver will be held accountable. I do hope for all involved it was due to an illness of the driver. Because of all the bus drivers I have talked to "NONE" can imagine doing such a stupid act of recklessness. The first thing we are taught and the most important is Safety First!! That is drilled into our heads constantly. If there was something mentally and physically wrong with this driver, why didn't the BOE know about it. All bus drivers undergo random drug and alcohol testing throughout the school year. A medical exam every one to two years. This tragedy is weighing very heavily on all the bus drivers I know. We are sick over it.
@positive - Good judgement does come with age. Good hand eye coordination and reflexes do not!
To me 8 speeding ticket regardless of the time period should be a red flag for getting a job as a bus driver. I used to drive like a lunatic in my younger days, and still only managed to get 3. It shows a willful disregard for traffic laws. Not the kind of person who should be entrusted for transporting children safely.
Geez 77 years old and with that record still driving a bus full of children. I hope that BOE gets their heads handed to them. Just another lazy example of what a waste BOE's really are. Just look at ours.
Denis - I agree. I have never gotten a speeding ticket in over 30 years of driving. I'm not a lunatic driver, but I'm certainly not a "grandma" either.
"8 speeding ticket regardless of the time period should be a red flag"
Keep in mind, that 26 year time period encompassed the era when the national speed limit was 55. I imagine it was much easier to speed when the limit was so low that you would get a ticket for what we consider the bare minimum (or driving in the slow lane) today.
It doesn't matter how old the driver is, that is a maneuver that simply shouldn't have been attempted, no matter what tee shirt they may or may not have been wearing.
I was on a Greyhound bus last year and the driver, who began her leg in Richmond to Baltimore to DC got lost twice. We were on some narrow roads in DC that a Greyhound should not be driving on but aside from a few turns that required a series of back and forths it wasn't bad. But we all get lost some more that others but there is no excuse for what this driver did last week.
CBGB The article states his license was suspended 2 times, not 14, and those two times were for parking tickets. Not sure where you saw 14.
Channel 7 reported 14 times since 1975. And yes that’s a long time ago but if true that’s crazy. I hope I go my whole liked with 0.
Mostly for parking tickets
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2018/05/driver_in_fatal_school_bus_crash_had_a_long_histor.html#incart_push
Good point but still are you kidding me 14 times for whatever. A liability. But most importantly the bigger fact is how the kids and other people affected on the bus and their families are coping/dealing with loss and drastic change to life. Sucks to think what they are going through....
I saw it on ABC, 6 pm News also about 14 suspensions. it did show that he went on Rt. 206 the wrong direction (southbound), then went back on Rt. 80, then crossed 3 lanes to do that illegal U-turn in the medium.
littlelu Whether the suspensions were because of unpaid parking tickets or not. It doesn't speak well for his integrity. Your license is not suspended for parking tickets unless you don't pay them. As a school bus driver, he should have had an impeccably clean driving record.
At the end of the day this person was clearly not the most suitable choice as a driver of that or any school bus. The suspensions, numerous tickets along with the advanced age for a person driving a school bus all point to a lack of due diligence and or proper oversight on the school districts part. The school district must ensure the utmost in safety for transporting students and in this case the key component, the driver, had insufficient qualifications to do so. I can't imagine there is not some level of culpability on their part.
Yeah there are going to be lawsuits and rightfully so. I wouldn't want someone approaching 80 driving my kids around.
“I can't imagine there is not some level of culpability on their part.”
Not if they are using the same “we take zero responsibility” legalease that our own BOE is now using on permission slips. According to the current language they are not liable even if they were negligent in their decision making.
Unbelievable. Clearly a result of our litigious society coupled with the lack of taking responsibility for ones actions or inaction's in this case.
I hope I can use the same defense in making some decisions in my life, particularly the ones that begin with me saying "hold my beer watch this"....
Sorry Bug, he drove for a school board. He is making far more than minimum wage. Most BOE bus drivers get the same benefits as teachers. Regular raises, medical, sick days, holiday pay, summers off. Just like teachers they cannot collect unemployment. Many work trips, special needs, some even go to other companies to work over the summer. The rules have changed over the past few years, it is very difficult to get a CDL SB endorsement. As it should be. Paramus BOE has a lot of explaining to do.
Tusk Only 6 states require school buses to have seat-belts, and only one of those six states, New Jersey (Very thankful for that), requires them to actually be worn by the students.I have a feeling many more will require them now that this accident has gone national.
Sorry AUNTIEL, you are WRONG.
He was making $20K+ and the following (quote):
The driver, Hudy Muldrow, 77, has a valid commercial driver’s license and an endorsement from the state to drive a school bus, said Mairin Bellack, a spokeswoman for the commission.
I heard today that they are attempting to add 3 point seat belts in all school buses which is shoulder harness and waist belt as in cars. Should have been done a long time ago! When I was a kid buses did not have seat belts.
And today I drove by the tragic accident site on 80 and I just felt so terrible and sad for the victims and families. Just awful
LittlePiglet Ok country I'm wrong about his salary. Does that include his benefit package? I talked to a driver yesterday from Trenton. He makes $22.00 an hour (he's been driving 2 years). His aide was out sick again, I asked him how many sick days do you get. He said 10 paid sick days. I'm glad for them. They deserve it and much much more in my book. I want to know how long this man has been driving a school bus, haven't heard it or read it anywhere. Now that most of the information is out, and if it's all true. What that driver did was criminal, as far as I'm concerned.
Another fact that most people do not realize is that in order to have a CDL you must pass a physical exam (every two years). The doctor who passed him for his exam will be facing a whole lot of scrutiny as well. In addition any Meds he was on will also be investigated.
hammer When I go to a doctor for my medical card, it needs to be renewed annually as opposed to every two years as I take medication for hypertension.
The 77-year-old school bus driver who crashed last week while trying to make a U-turn on Route 80 in Mount Olive with 44 passengers on board was charged Thursday with recklessly causing the deaths of a child and a teacher, according to criminal complaints.
https://www.dailyrecord.com/story/news/crime/morris-county/2018/05/24/paramus-bus-crash-bus-driver-charged-death-auot/639991002/
Sounds like a fitting charge. IDK what was going through this guys head to do what he did… It’s dangerous enough to attempt that with a car. To do it with a bus packed with children… Unreal…
He's suffered enough. Yes he was 100% wrong but come on. He's 77.
I just hope the bus company is charged with something. With his driving record, they NEVER should have hired him.
maja2, from that article, it states,
"Police believe Muldrow's bus, No. 2, detached from following Bus 1 and traveled on Route 206 South towards the on-ramp leading to the westbound lanes of Route 80."
"He's suffered enough."
With all due respect, he hasn't paid for his crime (if proven guilty) to society. That's how our legal system works. Old age doesn't exempt you from your actions. Especially when they get people KILLED.
All the bus drivers I know and talk to. We all agree, hang him. To bad offending the PC crowd and do-gooders.
It was a terrible accident for sure however he made a deliberate and conscious decision to attempt a ridiculously difficult maneuver to make that U turn. IN A SCHOOL BUS WITH 43 OTHER LIVES ON BOARD. If he were in his own vehicle alone it would be the height of lunacy to attempt that move. To attempt that In a school bus with the level of responsibility he had is simply incomprehensible and in my opinion criminal. He must pay the price. The others involved have paid with their lives. Some paid with amputations and disfigurements, others with serious injury and all with a horrific event that will FOREVER change them.
Botheredbyuu2
Sorry, but I beg to differ on that. Technically an accident, yes, BUT entirely preventable if the driver had not done something so reckless. He drove 44 passengers across an interstate highway that had a speed limit of 65mph just after an area that had a downhill curve to the right where with even the best of braking systems even a passenger car may likely not have been able to stop in time.
He had NO business being in that situation and even though he was also injured, two people lost their lives and many more were injured due to his direct actions. He had a number of other options and he did not follow ANY of them rather than making a completely boneheaded, risky, and illegal move.
Phil D. Exactly! Thank you Greg. I admit in the beginning I was giving him the benefit of doubt. When you are responsible for so many lives of the innocent behind the wheel of a vehicle, you do not take chances no matter the circumstances. He knew it and ignored it. I have zero pity for him.
I’m with auntiel and Greg position of responsibility - he had custodial charge of 43 souls - he hangs
4catmom "He's suffered enough."
He should be suffering, it's called a conscience, that voice in the back of his mind reminding him forever of what he did.
I read the superintendent was very angry because he was not aware of his driving record. Isn't that his business to learn about the person who is being hired? Am I correct in thinking he was employed by the Paramus School District and not an outsourced company?
He had a clear record as far as insurability was concerned - there’s nobody else to hang but the operator
Do you people think the guy drove a school bus out of boredom or did he really need the extra money for food,housing and medical bills? If it was the latter, there's going to be a lot more accidents, sad to say.
G-remnant It was PREVENTABLE - his RECKLESS actions (he is being charged with RECKLESS vehicular HOMICIDE- "accident."
You do the crime, you do the time. Sorry- no sympathy/sob story about "having to pay bills"... don't we all.... the only people I have sympathy for are the families of those killed by his recklessness.
Actually Auntiel, I was referring to the part of him being a CDL driver and recommended by the state as what you were wrong about.
In any case, it's a very sad situation that seems like it could have been avoided if in fact it's true what he did and is being charged with.
I can't imagine the impact this is having on those that are traumatized from this huge error.
This whole thing is very confusing and to say the least very sad. I heard on WRNJ this morning he told his son he did not make a U turn. Another station said he told authorities he did nothing wrong. The only eye witness that we know of is the truck driver. I think we won't know the truth until they want us to. I'm sorry I can't let this go, it's to heart wrenching. I drive by that spot every day and my heart sinks. So many things go through my mind. The most painful emotion when I drive over that knoll is the thought of seeing a school bus sideways in front of me. I can not imagine the horror that truck driver felt at that moment. The teachers looking out the window and saying what the hell, then bang. No time to react, no time to think. I know there are many accidents on 80 and 78 every road every day. But this one hits to close to home for me. I can't shake it.
Auntiel- i agree with you 100percent. I live in long valley pass it all the time, just cant shake it.
Laura auntiel,
It's all about perception vs empirical evidence. This driver believes what he says. This is what he 'perceives."
It is how Americans base what they do now. Not on facts, but on beliefs.
It is why people feel the way they do about Trump.
It is why people feel the way they do about Hillary.
It is why the rich feel the way they do about the poor.
It is why the poor feel the way about the rich.
It is why we have the #metoo movement.
It is why there is an incel movement.
Same with religion, etc.
Most of these issues you don't have actual facts and proof to work with, just your beliefs that can be shaped through social media.
Add that to logical fallacies and here you are.
At least here you have a camera, you have your empirical evidence. His perception does not matter anymore.
Which is why these police cameras are the best thing since sliced bread, even better than the bread.
Nothing better than to see the video of the situations unfold...
"I heard on WRNJ this morning he told his son he did not make a U turn. Another station said he told authorities he did nothing wrong."
They need to make him watch the video and then try to explain how he thought what he did was in any way legal.
The front page of the early Sunday Edition of the Star-Ledger quotes a Pastor who visited the driver as saying he's "sad, but feels he did no wrong." Are you f'ing kidding me?
Perhaps during his trial he'll finally understand.
Laura, Antiel, I have the same lingering horror and sadness - every time I pass that location - almost daily. It certainly is a tragedy that has touched many deeply.
rleaf Phil,
Camera or no camera, his perception is he did nothing wrong.
It won't matter what evidence. It won't matter if they put him in jail.
Perception trumps empirical evidence in the warped mind.
Superintendent knew driver was ineligible to drive children but hired him anyway...
http://newjersey.news12.com/story/38322592/report-paramus-superintendent-knew-of-drivers-spotty-record-before-bus-crash
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/index.ssf/2018/08/after_deadly_crash_3-point_sea.html#incart_river_index
A new law requiring 3 point seat belts in all NJ school buses. This was written and passed in reaction to the fatal accident.
I feel clearly the requirements for a DRIVER of a school bus needs to be examined and modified. Allowing a less than optimal driver of a school bus is not the best choice. Sadly this point was exposed at the expense of two lives in this case as that 77 year old driver had no business behind the wheel of a school bus. The two vehicular homicide charges support that fact.
Thanks for the update, Greg. Although I agree about the driver, I have to think 3 point safety belts aren’t a bad thing, right?
I know there will be a cost but I remember getting on my first school bus as a kid in the 80’s and my mom asking the driver why there were any seat belts. That was 30 years ago.
Busses do have lap belts but that’s it. Shoulder straps are a good thing.
An additional note on the accident... all the bus drivers made the illegal u turn. They should all be fired and have their bus driving licenses revoked.
and he crossed 3 lanes without apparently looking for oncoming trucks and cars.
(to do the illegal U-turn, which I think he is backing out of saying now, isn't he?)
All drivers over 60 should be retested every 5 years. Also, this comment from Jesse
"An additional note on the accident... all the bus drivers made the illegal u turn." I had not heard nor seen that anywhere. I must have missed that. Anyone know if this is true and where it was reported?
Jesse132
Could you provide a link to a story that actually states that because this is the first time I've heard that. All the stories I've read have stated that he was the only one that missed the turn towards Waterloo Village and that he took the exit onto 80W, either by accident or design to try to get to where he needed to go. The other two buses were said to have been safely at the Village for a while, then found that the other bus had been in the accident. I thought the stories had also said that he was actually the first bus until missing the proper turnoff, in which case for them to make the same turn he tried would be after the accident.
I mean if they indeed did do the same thing he did before he attempted it, then they need to bear some of the blame for the whole mess, but if there's no valid source material to state that they did, then that's just rumor mongering and not constructive at all to justice.
I was told this by someone who claimed to have seen the video. I was unable to find evidence backing this person’s claims. Sorry for the misinformation.
Jesse132
Stuff happens. I'm glad you clarified things. Unfortunately, people sometimes claim things for the wrong reasons, as that person may have done. I mean it is possible that the police were keeping forther info under wraps for now, but everything I saw didn't seem to support that and you'd have thought that when LEOs viewed the footage they'd definitely have made note of and mentioned that he was just following the other two drivers and that he would have used that as part of his defense.
I still think that unless he was blindly following GPS after missing the turn he has no defense. I seriously wonder why, especially in today's world of cell phones, etc. nobody was coordinating things better between the buses to begin with. Normally a parent or teacher chaperone sitting behind or across from the driver would be the one coordinating with the other buses. All in all I think many school districts may need to rethink how they coordinate and navigate field trips like this.
Shoulder belts to go with the lap belts are great, but need to be adjusted properly to each individual child's size or else they may do more harm than good and give a false sense of security. I imagine the next push may be for air bags, but that's a huge can of worms which I won't even try to get into. Seat and/or bus design may be a more practical goal in terms of achieving greater safety.
https://youtu.be/SrQFDzD3YyA
Listen to this job with CPR in progress and ejection - we need to ensure we have competent and cogent people behind the wheel transporting children.
Skippy
Thanks, I had heard parts of that before. It's heartbreaking.
"we need to ensure we have competent and cogent people behind the wheel transporting children." I couldn't agree more.
Indeed, while there is special training for school bus drivers, there should be an additional and higher level of training for those who wish to qualify for out of town field trips, such as this one. Many regular routes don't have major portions of travel along major highways, such as Rt. 80. There should also be requirements that they familiarize themselves with the route to be taken and have a "navigator/coordinator" on each bus to both make sure the route being followed is correct and that all drivers are kept on the same page as to where each bus is and their status.
There are chaperones already for field trips, in terms of teachers (and parents in some cases). The "navigator/coordinators" for each bus could be easily preselected which would help also to "take some of the load off the drivers themselves.
I did chaperone a high school team for 9 seasons. The buses always had lap seat belts in them and the students were told by me to put them on. As soon as we headed down the road you would heard the unbuckling start. It wasn't until one night when a driver hit the side rumble strips did you hear the seat belts go back on.
The bus drivers would never enforce what I was requesting from the students. It should be a law that the students have to wear a seat belt. So, until this happens even a 3 point seat belt won't be any good unless actually worn!
magpie “It should be a law that the students have to wear a seat belt.”
How would it be enforced (and with what penalties if the students are minors)? Even with you physically on the bus as a chaperone the students didn’t remain buckled up.
Agreed - I think it would make more sense looking at how drivers are screened hired trained and compensated first.
I believe it already is the law in NJ that all students must where a seatbelt on a school bus. A few other states require seatbelts on school buses, but we are the only state that requires students to wear them.
After deadly crash, three-point seat belts now the law for N.J. school buses.
https://www.nj.com/bergen/index.ssf/2018/08/three-point_seatbelts_now_the_law_for_school_buses.html
Former H-Town Dad Well here it is, the official tape of the bus crossing 80 in front of the red dump truck. It goes quickly, but it's plain as day. That driver of the bus is NO doubt 100% guilty. That's worse than being just a stupid driver, it's criminal. imo. It's hard to watch.
https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/bergen/paramus/2018/11/09/video-paramus-school-bus-crash-shows-driver-make-left-across-rt-80/1945210002/?fbclid=IwAR3uSgmkDX3G68qtQOwT8dkt7ogHG2c9aOUwRW8JXGDujH5GO2ZFKGDxvY0
Wow, and they had to sue to get this released. Why was the State covering this up? i guess it's just a natural tendency of government.
Everyone was so quick to put some blame on the dump truck driver (I admit I initially thought maybe he was speeding in the left lane) but, like auntiel said, it is clear to see that truck was blindsided and had no chance whatsoever of stopping in time. Who would ever expect a bus to pull something like that? So heartbreaking that two innocent lives were taken that day because of that driver's actions. Cant imagine how those families are feeling with this video being released.
Thecatsmeow Outrageous. The bus driver should spend the rest of his life incarcerated and think 24/7 about what he has done. I hope he is tormented by the thoughts of the innocent lives he took and the many others that his actions changed forever.
The lawsuits will fly as they should. This 77 should spend the rest of his life rotting in jail. Sadly he thinks he did nothing wrong. That school district will get pounded and needs to examine how they vet school bus drivers.
I almost saw a duplicate accident yesterday while driving on Rt. 46 east in Rockaway. Here is what I saw.
Bus One pulled out of the bowling alley parking lot in front of me and stopped at an angle blocking the east bound lane and the shoulder and then turned on the flashing yellow lights. This was done to allow Bus Two to exit the parking lot also. Bus Two was maneuvering the bus to get a better angle to exit the parking lot. After almost a minute Bus Two was ready to make a left hand turn onto 46 east. I saw the dump truck coming on 46 west and thought is this bus really going to pull right out in front of the dump truck. Yes it did on a wet rainy day and it was a near collision.
Bus Two then moves to the shoulder so Bus One can pass. There is traffic light about 100-150 feet from where the buses were exiting the parking lot. Bus One goes through the yellow light. Bus Two goes through the red light. It wasn't even a question of was it yellow when Bus Two reached the traffic light it was solid red.
unbelievable
What blatant stupidity on the part of that bus driver. I feel terrible for the poor guy who was driving that dump truck. There was nothing he could do and unfortunately he probably still beats himself up about the accident.
Gosh CBGB, I wish your were able to film that. That's BS. Again, beyond stupidity. The district needs to be aware of this. It needs to be stopped immediately. A phone call to the district of the time, place and if possible bus numbers is a good start. They would have to go out and observe the situation. I would also call the police and tell them what you saw and you did call the district. I am sure this is happening every day. Wish I was there and witnessed it, believe me it would never happen again.
It's the bus company. They pay peanuts and this is the kind of stuff they get. A janitor gets a pension but the school bus driver with dozens of children under his responsibility gets peanuts...
No doubt about that, Calico.
I have a close friend who drives a truck. Almost 30 years ago a young lady in a convertible Mustang drove head on into him on route 206. He went right over her. Even though they found a suicide note at her home stating she planned on doing that, to this day he is still haunted by that awful scene.
If bus companies and school districts treated the bus driving position as a profession or at least skilled labor, it would help. Finding people with ads like "no experience necessary" and "we'll help get your CDL", in addition to paying $12-$18 dollars an hour for people part time will not get serious, committed, skilled bus drivers. It's insane as there is no more important cargo or passengers than passengers in a school bus. You get seniors, housewife's and whoever else they can round up. It is just idiotic in my opinion.
As an aside I'm not stating all seniors or housewives would not make great bus drivers, just as it stands now the vetting process leaves quite a bit to be desired.
CBGB, hopefully you will, as auntiel suggests, call the district and/or the police. You might be saving childrens' lives!
Stop judging and putting down amount paid. Office jobs are over paid to sit on Facebook all day and have all holidays off.
Probably go shopping on Thanksgiving too.
Lol
Wendy cirinelli How much money you make has nothing to do with it!! Being stupid is being stupid. It has no baring on how educated you are or how much money you make. You have been entrusted with children's lives and your driving a heavy vehicle. The only way to do that job is to do it smart. No matter what. The end!!!!
If a school bus driver earned a greater salary, not simply a marginal at best hourly rate, you will attract and keep a more serious, professional, and responsible driver. I feel suitable monetary compensation would elevate the position from a part time "hey I can do that" to a career that folks would take serious as they should. As it stands now you just won't get that true dedication and real sense of responsibility consistently from most people at the current nominal pay scale. It's the old you get what you pay for scenario.
In addition to the CDL with passenger endorsement requirements a detailed and rigorous comprehensive training and specialized driving course should be mandatory with a earned completion if you will. Not just a school bus driving course that one attends. It needs to be training that one must earn the right to be able to drive a school bus.
This was discussed earlier, but how about changing the rules so that the orange school buses are no longer allowed on interstate highways.
"How much money you make has nothing to do with it!!"
Gotta go with Greg on this one. You get what you pay for.
"Gotta go with Greg on this one. You get what you pay for."
Yes, I agree as well.
I have a good friend that has driven a bus for years, takes the position very seriously, funny thing is, she has had countless experiences of very similar actions...most by woman driving mini vans or SUV's ….putting make up on w/visor down, holding a coffee cup up to get that "last drop" while the vehicle drifts across the lane with children in the back seat , or rolls thru a stop sign while on the cell phone......It is like any other profession, there are good ones, and bad ones...However, there are parent's that are just as bad ( or worse ) by the examples they demonstrate...
My point is don't single out bus driver's, there are many , many others .
steven In viewing the video, you have to feel for the driver of the dump truck who must have just seen yellow in front of him almost all at once with absolutely NO chance of doing anything to avoid this horrendous crash. What I fail to understand is why the bus driver is only being charged with the 2 deaths and not the 42 counts of accidental injuries, but that may be a tool be the prosecutor to get him to plea guilty to that rather than the 2 homicides. I guess we'll have to see how the case develops. I haven't read anything about the bus driver "changing his tune" about having done nothing wrong, but as I mentioned above it will all become obvious in the video. It is all too obvious that he charged across Rt. 80 with blinders on, not paying attention to the oncoming traffic that presented a clear and present danger to himself and his charges in the bus. Was he that panicked about being late after missing the ramp to Waterloo or completely lost? Was he following GPS at all or someone else's instructions? It's too bad there isn't audio and video evidence from inside the bus, as there sometimes is in other localities, but I still can't find any conditions that could exonerate him or reduce his culpability in this situation.
Until the late 80's both North and South Carolina used to allow 16 and 17 year olds to be bus drivers. My brother used to drive bus for the Catholic School he used to go to while going to public High School and my own bus driver was a Senior at my High School. Apparently there was a loophole in the Child Labor Laws that allowed them to do so, until an accident in the late 80's called more attention to the personal driving records of some of the young drivers and the U.S. Dept. of Labor managed to put a end to the practice over the course of a couple of years, first outlawing 16 year old drivers, then 17 year old drivers about 6 months later.
The bus driver on my route both of my years there, was a Senior at my HS. We never had any issues insofar as being at risk or unsafe and they were perhaps surprisingly professional at the task. They accounted for approximately 1/3 of all drivers and when the new laws went into place, they were short drivers and were forced to use other school workers who were uncertified to "fill in the holes", including custodians and cafeteria workers. That had to be scary until they were able to find and hire the needed amount of properly certified and qualified drivers.
So a male bus driver does a reckless, stupid act and 1) we are told not to single out bus drivers and 2) women drivers are then singled out. Way to excuse this MALE bus driver. Nd deflect.
Absolutely ridiculous.
EweIdjits I am in complete agreement of bus drivers making more money. Driving the actual vehicle is the easy part. What's sitting behind you and what's going on around you is the difficult part. It's multitasking. You have to drive a 15 ton vehicle at the same time being aware of everything on the road, in front, back and two sides of you. All the while you have 54 noisy children talking, laughing, and sometimes not well behaved. You also have to put up with the whiners, cry babies and bullies. And then there's the parents. A big yellow school bus is a target for those who hate that vehicle. They will pull out at the very last second, they will blow through your reds, they will curse and give you the finger just by being in their space. A bus driver needs to start that vehicle in the wee hours of the morning. With the new idle laws you may not let your vehicle warm up more than 10 minutes. It is a big metal box that doesn't warm up until noon. A bus is cold in the winter and it's hot in the fall and spring. The only air conditioning is 22 down. Now I ask, how much is that job worth?
https://www.nj.com/traffic/2019/12/hero-tow-truck-driver-honored-for-freeing-kids-from-fatal-bus-crash-hear-his-story.html
Man honored for his actions the day of this fatal crash.
Better late than never.....he should have gotten this award within a month or two, not 1-1/2 years later. Congrats to him for their help and intervention!
What happened to that bus driver? Didn't the trial get moved to another county?
Absolutely a hero. One can only imagine when witnessing arguably a worse case scenario accident- a school bus on a highway hit so hard it was torn apart from its chassis laying on its side filled with children and adults. Arriving as the first person to such a horrific scene would be challenging to deal with for most yet this man acted seemingly quickly and decisively.
It’s hard for civilians to step up to the plate for things like this. It’s wonderful that he helped. Many people stop and video stuff with their phones which in my opinion is just wrong. He is a hero for sure. God bless him!
"He said he pulled his tow truck to block the highway, in case anyone had been thrown from the bus on the road and to prevent other vehicles from colliding with the wreckage."
Smart thinking, and self-less from the initial moment. In a situation like that- it is easy for that to end up causing damage to his vehicles.
I was a medic and EMT in the Army. On our way back from training for a few months in the Mojave desert we were in caravan in buses and driving down I-25 came into an unexpected blizzard. (which was weird after having just left extreme heat and sand storms)- but being tired most of us were pretty much asleep. Visibility got real poor real fast.
All of a sudden we heard the bus driver yell HOLD ON! We all looked up just in time to realize he had slammed the brakes on and we were sliding out of control (at probably 50-60mph) into muilt-lane completely stopped traffic.
It was for me, at that time- worst case scenario. Something out of a movie. Large numbers of cars literally flying in the air, flung like toys. Crushed, mangled, shattered, you name it.
There was myself and another medic on that bus- and a few others on the other buses that ran out. It was a horrible experience running from vehicle to vehicle- chaos and tragedy. Made worse by the thought of innocent people just sitting in traffic listening to music then BANG.
All of us medics had dealt with bad stuff before- limbs gone, bodies crushed, but somehow when it is someone who was 'in' made it not as bad as the 'innocents'....
All of this meaning- I can't fathom a normal guy having to go through that with children, even if most were not seriously hurt.
110% he is a hero. Can we donate or show our appreciation to him somehow? He never asked for that burden, and may never admit his nightmares.
The EMS world is not an easy world, some scenes are burned into your brain and you will never forget them. For a civilian to step in and rescue children is a wonderful thing. Hero for sure!
Over the years I have had the pleasure of knowing many selfless first responders. I was told long ago that the worst question you can ever ask them is what is the worst thing that they have ever seen. So I never do. No point in making them have to relive that. Having to deal with a situation like a school bus crash, as a civilian, and handle it so well is amazing.
Guilty plea. Sentencing in February.
http://newjersey.news12.com/story/41490235/bus-driver-pleads-guilty-in-crash-that-killed-paramus-teacher-student
the Bus Driver got 10 years in jail. he's 79 now.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/family/school-bus-driver-sentenced-to-10-years-in-prison-for-deadly-new-jersey-crash/ar-BB10pF0U?ocid=hplocalnews
Luca I mean I don't know his level of remorse, how deliberate his tragedy was, but I just hate to throw away a resource just for vengeance if JUSTICE might be served in a better way.
He was working before, maybe he wants to work some more. Maybe they can work-furlough him to talk to others about how what he did changed his and others lives. Maybe there's a better way than an EOL, throw away the key scenario. Maybe the warden or concerned friends can find a way to make his jail time have some meaning, some hope, for him and others.
.
strangerdanger I agree Luca...….. I thought I heard he may be able to get out in 6...…..then probation…...but cant remember if that was a possibility or a fact. Such a reckless act he should be in for life.
This man made a terrible decision that caused a horrific accident which claimed two innocent lives. He certainly deserves jail time. That said, I don't think he deserved being called a "monster" and being told he should "rot in jail" by the twin sister of the young girl killed. In no way did this man intend to hurt anyone, he made a terrible decision. It's not like he broke into the family's home and shot the young girl. If I were the parent of this girl, I would be sure to get my daughter some help ASAP. Holding onto all of that anger can never be a good thing.
The guy was 78 driving a bus...the people who hired him walked away scotfree...with no responsibility what so ever
Bug3 - I understand what you mean, but since his CDL was valid there really could be no case against the bus company.
I doubt they got away scot-free. Not with all the ambulance chasing blood sucking lawyers there are in our society. That man (and his family) is living and will live the rest of his life in his own personal hell. What he did was not a malicious act. Call it what is was "stupid". Was he wrong? Yes. Should he be punished? Yes. Ten years?? I don't agree. I agree with Calico. That little girl needs grief counseling and therapy, more so the parents. Not words of hate and anger which were scripted. It was a tragedy for all involved. Until their hate for that man is taken out of the equation that family will never heal. So sad.
I’m torn on this as I’ve been thinking about it a lot. I was shocked at the 10 years for a 79-year-old man but then I thought if that was my child that was killed on the bus I would want him to go away for the rest of his life. Tough call, emotional, he made a horrible decision that day and I’m sure he’d give anything to have it back for a do over.
Hadenough strangerdanger
All along he continually claimed he did nothing wrong and refused to take any kind of remorseful or contrite stance for what he did and for the deaths and injuries to all involved. I don't know if he changed his tune on the advice of his lawyer or what (since I don't know what was in the man's heart), since it was a plea bargain after all and didn't go to a decision by either a judge or jury. His lawyer was able to get 20, yes 20, additional cases of assault by auto cases dropped by taking the plea deal.
If he made a mistake because of using a GPS device, then I could possibly see how he could have done something that stupid, but otherwise he knew the rules of the road and did not follow them. If he had never been in the area and was unfamiliar with the road, he should have been using a Navigational assistant, whether that be another adult on the bus helping spot signs, etc. or let the other bus lead, since apparently he missed the turn to Waterloo and the following bus didn't. While NJ changed the requirements for seatbelts due to this, they also should have addressed new requirements for drivers to help keep a situation like this from developing again.
It's a miracle that there weren't more deaths, considering the severity of the crash, which begs the question, what if it didn't happen this time? The next time he drove, perhaps half of the people on the bus may have been killed. I think that the time served fits what he did. It wasn't "just" a random unavoidable accident, but was caused by his failure to follow basic traffic laws and procedures. They said he is eligible for parole in possibly 5years and 9 months. Perhaps that will give him time to reflect on what he did wrong and the fact that YES, he DID do wrong. As I said, he likely ONLY apologized as a part of the plea agreement. Up until then he was stoic in stating he wasn't responsible and did nothing wrong.
Of course his lawyer states “10 seconds of bad judgment,” is what he's paying for, since he wasn't drunk and because he's elderly. Being elderly, he should have been even MORE careful in what he was doing, after all he was in charge of (and responsible for) a busload of children who had their whole lives ahead of them, as well as some adults. Can you imagine the trauma that all involved, both primarily and secondarily have to deal with on an ongoing basis, including the witnesses to the crash and the truck driver who had no chance to avoid them?
That all said, how do you pay that back? Personally, I think he should be fully debriefed on exactly what he did, why he missed the (what I think is an) obvious sign for Waterloo Village, and why he took the path that he did and what his plan was by doing what he did. Did he plan to make the U-turn and take the exit for 206 right after rather than taking another 15 minutes to go to 80 East and U-turn properly by the NJSP Barracks? I think perhaps as a condition of his sentencing and perhaps earlier parole he be made to tell his story and admit his guilt and what he is responsible for in front of driving education classes. The way he came in and sat down in court looked to be as if it was an inconvenience to him.
I'm glad that the 10 year old's father is working with Josh Gottheimer both at state and national level to require not just the 3-point seatbelts, but also a change in both education and the way things are currently done. IMHO that's the best way he can honor both his daughter and the teacher's deaths:
http://newjersey.news12.com/story/40470050/new-campaign-to-be-announced-on-school-bus-safety-following-deadly-i80-accident
Calico
I agree with you about the twin needing counseling at the very least. As a twin, she likely feels her siblings loss much worse than any other sibling would have been. Of course, I'm sure there's also likely a feeling of being somewhat "left behind", not only survivor guilt, but also because of possibly not getting the love and attention she needs from her parents who are pursuing the safety campaign, etc. He didn't deserve the extreme vituperation, but he should have known better, but then again 14 suspensions in 40 years? I've been driving for over that many years and have exactly one from being stupid when I was around 20. 88 in a 55 zone with nobody else on the road, except the unmarked NC State Policeman who was going the other way on a divided highway that turned around on the large grass median to pull me over. 90 day license suspension from my own stupidity as a young adult. I do question the bus company's role in this IF any of those suspensions were recent because that calls into question their wisdom in hiring him or allowing him to continue driving for them.
auntiel
I would agree with you IF some child had spilled something on him, road conditions changed rapidly (snow squall or unexpected fog bank, etc.), or something failed on the bus itself, but he knowingly and willingly made the choice to do something incredibly dangerous, rather than taking perhaps 15 extra minutes to perform a correct and safe alternative. He was responsible for the lives and safety of everyone on the bus and not only did he willingly abrogate that responsibility, but he refused to admit that he had done anything wrong at all up until he was offered a plea bargain with the dropping of the 20 assault by auto charges. It was an entirely preventable accident, which is entirely HIS responsibility. From his earlier attitude and demeanor, it's only that he's being punished that he seems sorry for. I feel badly for his family too, but HE was the one that did it to ALL of them, as my last post mentions.
He was 78, lost and confused...he made a bad mistake...not sure he should have been driving...but again he may have blocked out the accident...still resonsible
I wonder how many would feel so bad if the dump truck driver had been at fault and gotten 10 years. Many were extremely angry at him and were quick to throw blame before the facts and video came out. Or is it just the age of the bus driver that makes 10 years too much?
Mel81 Mel81
Good points!
By the way, if he was so "lost and confused", how did he know just where to make the illegal turn to get to the exit to turn around? If you're lost and confused, you pull the bus to the shoulder with the hazards on, let the other bus know you're delayed and then drive the bus filled with children safely and legally to your destination.
Sure, you'll be a bit later than the other bus, BUT you'll be there and the kids will have a great adventure tale to tell, rather than be traumatized and physically injured!
Sure, maybe he didn't realize that he was going to cut across the busy interstate highway at a point where the road has just curved and gone downhill towards him, rather than a long straightaway where they were all coming uphill towards him where people could see him perform his illegal move and possibly stop in time. That doesn't really matter. He made an almost right angle (well, a left 90 degree angle) turn across traffic in a vehicle that has poor acceleration and from a point of little visibility.
Let me repeat, 14 license suspensions (now 15). That is a LOT of mistakes and shows a pattern of bad behavior and poor judgement and the same goes for the company that hired him IMHO.
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