HPD Money Grab

I was just wondering how many people were caught in the Police Department's most recent Safety Initiative (aka money grab)? Yesterday afternoon, they had of their officer's sitting on something in the back of a pick up parked on High St. wearing shorts and a t-shirt. This way he could look into cars as they were driving towards Main Street. He would radio ahead to let the uniformed officers waiting at the municipal parking lot know who did not have their seatbelt on or had their phone in their hands.

Irishresq ✉
May '15

Is this your money grab? Since your name implies you are a lawyer.

hack ✉
May '15

Wear your seatbelt and don't talk on the phone while driving. Common sense people!! I'm glad they do these things because their is a lot of people who break the law.

townie14 ✉
May '15

I was just wondering how many people were caught in the Police Department's most recent Safety Initiative (aka money grab)? Yesterday afternoon, they had of their officer's sitting on something in the back of a pick up parked on High St. wearing shorts and a t-shirt. This way he could look into cars as they were driving towards Main Street. He would radio ahead to let the uniformed officers waiting at the municipal parking lot know who did not have their seatbelt on or had their phone in their hands.
Irishresq

Whats your point? If you were buckled up & and not on your phone, then there was nothing to worry about.

This is just another post by someone who is annoyed/bothered by something (that really is nothing) and trying to see if anyone one else agrees or if they can start a controversial thread.

Clyde Potts ✉
May '15

That's great! You have to applaud their ingenuity....

njglrider
May '15

Let the HPD "nail" some of the drug dealers in this town.

Unbelievable, they go to these lengths ....what a clever bunch they are!

pampurr ✉
May '15

There have only been warnings EVERYWHERE about the CIOT campaign from May 18 to May 31... if you still chose not to wear your seatbelt, chalk it up as an idiot tax.

ianimal ✉
May '15

Pampur just because you don't hear about drug dealers getting busted doesn't mean its not happening. They bust people with drugs all the time. Buy a scanner and listen to PD east frequency

townie14 ✉
May '15

So they create traffic on high st , then they tell why did u drive on the double lines, to go make left on main st, good thing they let me go, I was about to go to court and fight the ticket

stinko
May '15

botheredbyuu2 - The manpower is in addition to existing on patrol officers, paid for by grants. No waste.

GC ✉
May '15

As we give Irishresq just what he/she wanted.

Clyde Potts ✉
May '15

Idiot tax for sure but the grant money (I assume from the State) are still your tax dollars.

kb2755 ✉
May '15

I'll counter the "if you're doing nothing wrong" mantra with "if you look for trouble you'll find it" one.

While some good will come from this IMO this just adds to the "everyone is guilty" mentality pervasive in our society. Personally I think the overlord mentality is going to backfire in the long run, and if it does I do believe that very few will understand part of the reason why.

This isn't necessary at all except to issue summonses.

Justintime ✉
May '15

The seat belt laws were lobby ed f or by the auto insurance co so if you were found to not be seat belted in they would not have to pay insurance clams

Caged Animal ✉
May '15

FUD - Fear. Uncertainty. Doubt.


Anything to stick against the wall that draws attention away from the simple fact. Covering up the reality of plain law breaking. Prosecute the crap out of people when they break one law, but pure nannies when they break another.

GC ✉
May '15

All those complaining are probably those who got caught, and rightfully so.

Kudos, HPD. Keep up the good work!

Kris ✉
May '15

Stinko
How did they create traffic to make you go over yellow lines. Went thru and it looked like usual rush hour traffic?

justpassinthru
May '15

++ Justin.. I wear my seatbelt to be safe and don't text while driving because it's just stupid.. I would be happy to see driving texters be ticketed.. However, while driving home from work late last night on route 80 - near Mount Olive - a state police car passed on my left and shined a light into my car as he passed!! I assume he was looking to see if I was texting/wearing seat belt, or perhaps my car was similar to a car they were trying to locate for other reasons, but that method was dangerous.

pmnsk ✉
May '15

http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/magazine/index.cfm?fuseaction=display_arch&article_id=2108&issue_id=62010

work cited - Police Chief Magazine - View Article. (n.d.). Retrieved October 14, 2014.

http://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/gov-ferguson-missouri-court-fines-budget.html

work cited - Skyrocketing Court Fines Are Major Revenue Generator for Ferguson. (n.d.). Retrieved October 14, 2014.


It is clear that this is a new stream of government revenue

from a previous thread on the subject

skippy ✉
May '15

I don't text while driving, I email, it is safer..........

pmnsk, I too have had a police officer hit me with a spot beam while I was driving just like you, real nice of them to blind you as you are doing 65 mph at night right?

Darrin ✉
May '15

I agree totally the Police should monitor SEAT BELT USE (for the safety of the vehicle occupants) and CELL PHONE USE (for the safety of the all drivers on the road, and the vehicle occupants)
IF this is not a money grab and the Municipalities DO care about all drivers, passengers , and people using the roads then they SHOULD ,,

- Enforce the Laws Aggressively
- Collect all fines for guilty drivers
- Use some of the fines to cover the cost of Extra Enforcement of these laws and administration if needed
- Use the balance of the funds for Driver Education Purposes (Seat Belts and Cell Phones)
- The fines should not go into the Municipalities general pot and become a profit center for them BUT USED FOR APPROPRIATE PURPOSES..

These are TWO very serious areas that require additional enforcement and education ,,,

BlueFishEd ✉
May '15

Why is there a "punishment" for something supposedly done only for the sake of someone's safety (and affecting nobody else but that person)?

Do you send a bill to someone every time you catch them before they step off a curb into traffic, warn them about a deer in the road, etc.

Sure, distracted driving can be punishable because it potentially affects other people than those on the phone call. Perhaps even laws stating that adults are to be responsible for making sure children (too young to make their own life decisions) are using seat belts properly. Same goes for helmet laws etc. Dumb not to wear one, absolutely. Crime against the state or another person... hardly.

Mark Mc. ✉
May '15

I heard that too, went back to running red lights!

Darrin ✉
May '15

BlueFishEd,
it's NOT the job of the government to protect individuals from themselves - Following your argument for Seat Belts then all of the following should be illegal as well. Mountain Climbing, scuba diving, motorcycles, all types of motor racing, overeating etc..

Seatbelts do save countless lives. But does that mean I shouldn't be able to make the decision by myself? Laws are to protect us from each other not our selves. I assume you think an eating limit per day would be absurd but in principle is it any different? No.

IMHO - for minors - parents should be required to buckle up their children. they are not old enough to make choices for themselves..

skippy ✉
May '15

"Certain laws seem more like a way to make money then they are to "protect" us."

Of course they are. If they really wanted to get people to wear seatbelts, their punishment would be to watch an hour long video of nothing but images of people thrown from cars in MVAs where they weren't wearing seatbelts.

ianimal ✉
May '15

Once I was rear ended by another car at 5 corners while I was stopped at a red light. I was wearing a seat belt as I always do. Since I was wearing a seat belt, I was knocked a bit forward but was able to get back to the steering wheel rather quickly and hit the brakes before my car hit the car in front of me. I have no doubt that if I had no seatbelt on, besides probably injury to myself, I would not have been able to gain control of the car so quickly and would have hit the vehicle in front of me.
In fact, my body would have probably gone through the windshield and literally hit the vehicle in front of me.

So, seat belts do affect other drivers, the guy in front of me drove away without any incident while he would have been hit had I not had a seat belt on.

Perhaps fines are a way of paying the police salaries to make them waste time catching people who could otherwise hurt another driver?

TM

Troublemaker ✉
May '15

I think I saw that video in drivers ed - blood flows red on the highway

skippy ✉
May '15

Darrin, usually I enjoy your posts, but the helmet law is a good one. I have a transplant, and the doctors had told me to be listed in PA because they don't have helmet laws and the chance of receiving a life saving transplant is better there than in NJ. I have a lot of friends who received a transplant in PA because there isn't a helmet law. Think about it. It's not a statistic you want. Be safe young man.

Ms. Fishy ✉
May '15

" Is it because it's far easier and safer to grab even more money from people whom already pay for everything because they go to work everyday than going after dangerous jobless food stamp crack heads ?"

Are you worried about dangerous jobless food stamp crackheads who don't wear their seat belts not paying their fair share?

ianimal ✉
May '15

im pretty sure a democrat came up with these laws. Its all about that cash to pay for welfare and the such. Also, It's Darwinism. You don't wear your seatbelt, you die. It's that simple. You Aren't hurting anyone but yourself. People are stupid if they think that laws like this will help or stop you from doing something.

JFdaGR8
May '15

The current car seat laws are not even enforced. The Taxi vans are transporting kids to and from the schools without car seats.

CJ. ✉
May '15

Actually, I received my transplant in NJ from a NJ woman. Many friends in the transplant world have received theirs from PA. It's a sad day for the family who lose their loved one, so it's bittersweet for those of us who are on the receiving end of organ donation.
Happy to know you wear your seatbelt when driving, and a helmet when biking.

Ms. Fishy ✉
May '15

that's a bad idea caged, the best thing you can do is get away from that 600lb chunk of steel in a accident

Darrin ✉
May '15

"im pretty sure a democrat came up with these laws. Its all about that cash to pay for welfare and the such. Also, It's Darwinism."

Are we really such whack jobs that if it's a law we don't like, we assume it's a democrat? Even when in this county it's the Republicans ordering the crackdown, the Republicans giving the tickets and the Republicans manning the courts? Yeah, us Democrats can make them do anything, even peak in your windshield.

I hear Soros paid to import extra cops just to hand out extra tickets to unbuckled drivers in the right lane who were conservatively doing the speed limit.

We missed a trick though, we should just not let the car start to begin with unless you be buckled up.

Be proud, be free, don't wear your seatbelt; it's a $50 gamble. I am a Democrat and I do it all the time!

On a serious side though, once we get those new black boxes installed in our cars, our cars will ticket us and we can fire some cops. Add in WIFI and a printer and they can send the results to the state and your insurance for tracking and print the ticket right in your car.

mistergoogle ✉
May '15

If the insurance companies lobbied for a seat belt law, then statistically it must save lives, as the only way to "beat earnings" is to not pay death claims. I still believe it's a personal choice as sometimes a seat belt could kill you, depending how your hit. Children don't know any better, so I would buckle them in, all the time. Now we all wear our seatbelts... the insurance companies know how to prosper, that's enough evidence l need. Texting, phones and putting on makeup while driving ... that's a whole different topic as that directly affects the safety of the other drivers on the road.

sallysimpson ✉
May '15

Ghost cars are cash cows for the state.

pampurr ✉
May '15

So if the car's OBD starts to broadcast seat belt use, just pop a fake clip in the buckle...

Mark Mc. ✉
May '15

It's probably a CAN bus scanning device. I remember Car & Driver had a report about this:

http://m.caranddriver.com/features/can-your-car-be-hacked-feature

Interesting that law enforcement has an official hack, maybe through an interface specifically for them?

Justintime ✉
May '15

I used to think the same as most people here that wearing a seatbelt or not didn't hurt anyone but the person making that decision. However, there is a cost to society if you get killed or maimed in accident because of not wearing a seatbelt. If you become disabled and can't work, perhaps you end up on welfare, food stamps, lose your house ,etc. We all pay for that. So you really aren't just hurting yourself by not wearing a seatbelt. And I did start wearing it because it's the law. Now I wear it because it's a no brainer.

RAS ✉
May '15

Skippy, I have no idea. The article talks about telemetric system access, so that could be it.

If what John said is true, there *is* a way to communicate with vehicles wirelessly. It just doesn't seem to be an "available to the public" method. This also might explain the recent push for automakers to lock down their onboard computer systems via digital rights laws, to prevent people from hacking specialized systems that they want to keep hidden.

Or maybe not. It's not like today's society is moving toward that of "1984" or anything... ;-)

justintime ✉
Jun '15

money, safety, liberty; who knows which is on first. My bet is on safety and the rest follows.

The other day I had a emissions warning come up. Turns out it was a misfire. Turns out my four cylinder has 8 plugs and 8 coils, no distributor cap. It was getting a one-in-a-million misfire but repeatedly so the warning popped. But not enough to affect driving, no surges or stutters. Without the computer, I would not have even noticed. So they moved the plugs n coils around but then the tech noticed a sw upgrade and downloaded what we hope was the fix. Software problem.......

Point is the fix still required fussing around with the plugs and then reading tech notices to find and apply the fix. A manual discovery process and physical intervention by the tech that was costly for them and for me. I am sure the next step is wifi-enablement and automated downloads of all software upgrades. Frankly since much of our cars will be software controlled, I guess it is a good thing. I just wonder if I will still get a bill?

Are these cars better than older non-sw-controlled versions? I think so. And if we can remove the tech time for diagnosis, discovery, and implementation I just paid for, even better.

Meanwhile the "black box" is here with more features inevitable in that it takes a lot of the guesswork out of accident investigation; that's a good thing. But I am sure other "safety" elements like monitoring belt usage, speeding, etc. will follow. Then we'll tie in traffic lights, gps, camera monitoring, etc. etc. and you will be driving down the road, run a red light and the car will take your picture, the camera on the traffic light will snap a pic from there, and a ticket will be emailed to your address. We will be safer, the state will make more money, and we will lose a little more liberty in return. I guess it's better but it's a brave new world we're heading for.

mistergoogle ✉
Jun '15

I still feel government has no businesses protecting us from ourselves - only from each other

skippy ✉
Jun '15

just so i am clear is anyone arguing that seat belts don't work? That they don't save lives? Or is the only argument that you should have the right be be an idiot and not wear a seatbelt?

If there was no seatbelt laws how many of you would actually not wear a seatbelt? I really don't need a law to make me put a seatbelt on so for me this "money grab" is a non issue.

darwin ✉
Jun '15

I don't think anyone is arguing that seat belts don't work, just that it's not a government responsibility to mandate their usage.

There are a lot of dangerous objects in the world... cars, motorcycles, pools, ladders, chain saws, ice skates, bath tubs, drain cleaner, etc...

Should Uncle Sam step in every time you're planning on doing a Triple Lindy off your diving board and hand you a ticket/fine because you (and only you) could get hurt and have potential medical bills?

Or, should you as a responsible adult be able to make a personal decision about the risks you take on a daily basis, as long as they don't infringe on another person's rights (or injure them as well).

Mark Mc. ✉
Jun '15

It is my firm belief that our elected officials actually believe that we cannot be trusted with liberty and freedom. They honestly are convinced that society will be better if they regulate our lives as much as possible.


A lot of other horrible totalitarian societies started out with “good intentions” as well.

‘‘Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves." - Ronald Regan

skippy ✉
Jun '15

http://thelibertarianrepublic.com/new-jersey-nanny-state-will-now-fine-texting-walking/

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/texting-while-walking-banned-in-nj-town/

Texting while jaywalking may land you a ticket in Fort Lee, N.J.

if you didn't believe NJ is a nanny state -

skippy ✉
Jun '15

Hey Skippy - What if you are the driver of the car, who strikes the texting pedestrian?
The person texting and being hit, could be killed or catastrophically injured due to their carelessness.
The Driver could be traumatized over hitting a person, the rest of their life:
Coulda, Shoulda, Woulda - OMG I killed a person

and then: the Lawsuits $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Will H ✉
Jun '15

accidents happen - albeit tragic - does that mean we need more laws to prevent what possibly could happen?

skippy ✉
Jun '15

" I don't think I can respect your opinions anymore MG."
Not that I'm losing sleep over the obvious, but if you expected to respect every opinion of anyone, much less me, well sorry, jokes on you. I used the word "guess" cuz I'm sort of on the fence on this especially since I am in frequent felony.

But at $45 and no points, I don't see this as a HUGE governmental overreach with the trade-off being lower insurance rates. That does affect everyone. I personally gamble with this law all the time and have yet to feel that big-brother feeling about it. If this is where you draw the line for totalitarianism, you're government intrusion meter is set to extra very sensitive.

"In 2002, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration reported that the deaths and injuries that result from not wearing a seat belt cost an estimated $26 billion annually in medical care, lost productivity and other related costs."

" increasing seat belt usage in Minnesota to 94% from the current rate of 84% could reduce the cost of crash-related hospital care an average of $19 million annually over the next 10 years."

http://www.electricinsurance.com/learning_planning/auto/Research_Proves_Using_Seat_Belts_Cuts_Hospital_Bills.asp

Insurance, whether you like it or not, is a communistic experience where everyone shares a common pool of funds. Therefore getting caught, and not by the police, over the misuse of the simple procedure of buckling up does indeed affect the pocketbook of everyone else in the pool. Darn that socialism, it's everywhere :>) even in those robber baron insurance companies :>)

mistergoogle ✉
Jun '15

auto insurance - voluntary - u b the judge
health insurance - voluntary - Obama be the judge
life insurance - ok, ya gots me

meanwhile, millions of Chinese voluntarily vacated communism by leaving the country.

not broke any more.

mistergoogle ✉
Jun '15

re:
http://www.hackettstownlife.com/forum/687139#t687249

Looks like the fbi used my idea first

https://www.yahoo.com/tech/s/fbi-behind-mysterious-surveillance-aircraft-over-us-cities-070836765--politics.html

Justintime ✉
Jun '15

Life and the extension of it is the real cost we will have to endure. We are going through it now as the population ages.

Sure there is a cost to rehabilitate or heal the injured but I suspect that pales in comparison to the cost of keeping everyone alive. If no one were to reach the golden years and go through all of the costs (procedures, tests, housing, and care) our costs would be reduced I think.

I believe that seat belts increase our safety. I choose to wear one. I do not believe that it's the gov't's place to mandate it. I dont believe LEO hiding to issue tickets has anything to do with safety and I dont think we are saving money by keeping people alive. Life is expensive.

swimswitdafishes
Jun '15

Actually I missed it completely ha ha.

I put the voluntary on the ObamaCare mandate side, not the pooling side, thus my comments which oddly enough seemed to suffice.

Guess I got an ObamaCare itchy trigger finger too :>)

Good one JIT, humor nicely played, subtly delivered.

mistergoogle ✉
Jun '15

Well here's the real answer to avoiding tickets and keeping your insurance rates down.

mistergoogle ✉
Jun '15